What a mess! There's just too many variables for my little processor. There's no right answer, and there's no best solution.
Yep, it's time to pick which routers I'd suggest for a CCNP lab. We've discussed many in the last few months in this blog. But "best" depends on a lot of factors, including cost that varies from week to week on Ebay, features supported by each platform/IOS/feature set, the availability of that IOS version/feature set based on your relationship with Cisco, whether Feature Navigator lists all features or not, and whether you really need to practice several features that have only a little coverage for the CCNP exams.
So, what to do? Here's my plan: today I'm posting some new info, summary info, and making some assumptions to narrow things down a bit. Then I'll announce a little contest for fun, and really for sure finally wrap up this series with some discussion of sample lab gear for the three budgets ($800, $1200, and $1600).
First, to the models. As of today, I'm not looking at any more models past those listed here. I priced each of several models that we've either already discussed or someone has mentioned in the last week or so. For those, I'm going to add enough of the optional features to the mix to make them useful for CCNP, eg, adding a WIC-2T to 2610s. Then I priced it out on Ebay once again, and I'm using those numbers. Here's what I came up with:
Everyone will probably have a different opinion on the pricing, and rightly so.
Here's what I assumed when estimating a price. First, I looked not for the very cheapest today on Ebay, "buy it now", but for the lowest price for which there were at least a few routers available at that price. I tried to look for prices of models with max memory (RAM and Flash) to be safe, or look at the prices to add the memory to max. I wasn't fully scientific on the price guesstimates, and I know these prices are a little higher than some of the anecdotal evidence you folks have offered - my goal is to use a price that most anyone could get tomorrow, with enough memory to not have to worry about memory anymore. Finally, I completely ignored the IOS on the actual routers for sale today - I'll make the usual disclaimer that it's up to you to decide how to obtain and use IOS images per your relationship with Cisco.
Next, I tried to get a handle on all those features for the different exams and feature sets to support them. Let me make some general comments first. The ONT features are support on most every IOS feature set and most every platform, so I ignored them. I also assumed that the routers would use the most recent mainline or T-train version available on each model. I then assumed the best feature set to get all features for all exams, which generally means "IP/FW/IDS/Plus IPSEC 3DES" on older models, and "Advanced IP Services" or better on the later models. Here's the specific ones for each model:
Odom, CCIE No, 1624, splits time between writing books for Cisco Press and teaching classes for Skyline ATS. In his 25-ish years in the networking industry, he has worked as as a pre-sale and post-sale SE for a few networking vendors, as well as a network engineer implementing network technology. Wendell has spent the majority of the last 15 years teaching, consulting, and writing about networking technologies, most of which in some way relate to Cisco products. His books include titles on QoS, CCIE R/S, as well as several titles related to CCNA certification, including the September 2007 book CCNA Official Exam Certification Library (CCNA Exam 640-802) (Read a sneak peek of chapter 7). Click for the list of current titles by Wendell.
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Cisco 877
Hi Wendell
What do I win? :p
Anyway, the Cisco 877 has a built in 4 port FE switch which is capable of becoming 4 independant SVI's all routable, and can use all RIP/v2, EIGRP, OSPF & BGP.
They also do IPS, which is one of the harder to fulfill features.
Oh, I almost forgot, its the only router that has built in IOS based Wireless.
Now, if it could only do Frame Mode MPLS, it would be a winner!!
Personally, I've even got enough flash for a bigger image if it ever existed.
How about a book?
Shaun,
Was there ever any doubt? The prize is a book, but the winner gets to choose - one of the Cisco Press books.
Remind me what you spend on your 877's? They seemed a little pricier than I had remembered ($400 US) when I looked earlier this week.
Yep, getting the MPLS part does seem to be the sticking point! Sounds like you've been a step or 3 ahead of me in this process the whole time...
Wendell
877 Price
Wendell, I paid $650 AUD about 2.5 years ago for my Cisco 877 Wireless when 1 Australian dollar was about 0.75 US cents.
I was also able to get a 16MB Intel Strata Flash module for $90 AUD, about 1 year ago through a friendly contact.
So all in all, I got a good price in USD terms, and it is the most feature filled up to date routers you can get for the price.
I think to get anything remotely close to it in terms of hardware and latest functionality, you are starting to look at 1000's of dollars.
A few questions/suggestions
Good stuff as always Wendell.
I think I will be breaking down and finally purchasing my lab quite soon. I have been relying on alternate means up until this point for hands-on practicing. I had a things that I would like your perspective on.
I noticed that the models and expansion card selections that you noted maxed out at 2 serial ports (single WIC-2T card). Do you think it would be beneficial to have more on at least one router so a frame relay situation could be setup, or is that not very relevant to the CCNP tests?
An alternative to the WIC-2T card would be the NM-4a/s (assuming you have a free NM slot). They seem to be similarly priced. Do you know if a NM-4a/s port could plug into a WIC-2T port, or are they not compatible? Do you see an advantage of using one over the other?
Lastly, from your experience looking at CCNP and on to CCIE R&S, do you see a benefit to having more than one Ethernet connection on a router? Are there scenarios that you have experienced where this is a requirement?
Thanks for all the help!
A few questions/opinions
J,
to your specific questions:
For a FR switch, getting a 2nd WIC-2T makes sense. Alternately, I'm a big fan of getting 2 2501's ($50 us), and a few cables, and you get a 4-port FR switch without having to use one of your other routers. Certainly, the NM-4A/S does the trick as well, but they're limited on clock rate (I don't remember the fastest speed - anyone out there remember? 128Kbps comes to mind, but that's fuzzy.) You can connect the A/S serial ports to those on WIC-1T and WIC-2T, just make sure you have the right connectors on the cables.
Frame's not as big a deal on CCNP any more. One reasonable choice would be to use one router with 2 serial interfaces as a FR switch only occasionally, with w other routers as FR DTE's, and get in a little practice. Then you don't have ot worry aobut spending additional $$ for routers just for FR switching.
If you plan to move on to CCIE, I'd bite the bullet and get at least 4 ports of Frame Relay going.
On the 2 LAN ports per router... need, or want? I personally don't know of any specific need, but I don't keep every nook and cranny of CCIE in my head on a regular basis. It is convenient, but for anything on a router where I really need more than 1 LAN interface, I think you can do the same with trunking, and create two subinterfaces on the router, to do the trick.
You're welcome! Hope this helps.
NM 1E2W and WIC 2T (Cisco 3640)
Hi Wendell,
I really love your posts on CCNP topics. I keep reading them again and again, and thanks to you, now I have a guideline to build a CCNP lab.
In the chart of router models and their additional gears, you listed 3640 along with NM 1E2W and WIC 2T. It turned out to me that WIC 2T was not supported on NM 1E2W. So should I go with (2) WIC 1T or (1) NM A/S to make 3640 useful for CCNP lab? Currently I have (3) 3640s with NM 1E2W only.
Thanks a lot for your time,
Alan
Big whoops by me!
Hey Alan,
Wow, my bad. Sorry for taking so long to reply as well.
Here's a link (http://www.cisco.com/en/US/partner/products/hw/routers/ps214/products_tech_note09186a00800ae37f.shtml) that has a list of what's supported, and it indeed supports the idea that WIC-2T isn't supported on 3620/3640 with NM-1E2W. Options:
buy a NM-1FE2W instead,
use the NM-1E2W with a pair of WIC-1Ts
get the NM-A/S, and live with the slower clock rates on the interfaces,
Get an NM-2W, which appears to support the WIC-2T's per the table.
So, it kinda blows my cost plan using the 3640's in the water. Sorry I pointed you down the wrong path, and thanks for bringing it up so politley! Hope this helps.
Wendell